Hey there! I'm kinda new to the game and I think I have a small problem: I'm getting tabled pretty much all the time at T2-T3 in small games (1000 pts).
I play alien hives vs prime brothers, and I get shoot off the board every time. Plenty of terrain, I (try to) pay attention to my units placement (hiding them, keeping distances), but the low quality, low def and low range of everything are definitely a problem when facing the f*ckhuge stats of the prime brothers.
I'm going (slightly ) overboard with hive swarms and maybe it doesn't help: 2x6 with twin bio-pistols, 36 shots sounded like a good idea to deal with those high defense targets...but with a 6+/6+ 18", I feel that they are useless against the 3+/2+ and A3 24" auto-rifles of my opponent. And the practice doesn't show anything else: I'm getting (at best) pinned with the 15-shots-per-activation pretty much every time. T1 half unit, T2 dead or one poor little bug trying to survive...And it feels like it's a liiiiittle bit too much. How am I supposed to deal with this? Giving them regeneration in the psy phase doesn't help either...
My (2x5) soul snatchers don't have any luck too facing his raider squad in melee. A3 + furious + prime..? bruh.
Can't kill anything, can't hold objectives... I'm starting to wonder if I should go for a better army and keep the hive bois for vs AI games.
Honestly it's not you or the Alien Hives (especially after the recent rework) , it's Primaris Marines Prime Brothers.I feel the balance in OPR is pretty good except Prime Bothers (and Change Brothers but that's a different argument). A 2+ DEF Regeneration (that stacks with Regeneration) and A3 Rifles as standard issue is not fun to try and deal with. Unfortunately I don't have much of a solution except maybe give your units more Rending? Unfortunately if you are playing with physical models (like I assume most people do) that's easier said than done. The only suggestion I could give is is have your opponent run them as standard Battle Brothers but that's really not a solution.
If Prime Brothers just had Regeneration like Plague Brothers but the versatility of Battle Brothers then they'd be ok. But that A3 Rifles/double Regeneration is not fun. I have few legit critiques with OPR but one is Prime Brothers.
The standard is the main issue I think. Giving prime brothers double regeneration is a bit much. There are also different rules for the two regenerations. I would suggest just giving the standard +1 to the regeneration roll.
As it is now with standard Against AP- hits: About 14 hits to take one down. Against AP 3 hits: About 3 hits to take one down. Against rending: About 1,5 hits to take one down. (rending negates one of the regeneration rolls, but not both)
With my suggestions of the standard giving +1 to the rending: Against AP- hits: About 13 hits to take one down. Against AP 3 hits: About 3 hits to take one down. Against rending: 1 Hit to take one down.
This would make them slightly weaker against normal hits (but still at double the amount of hits of battle brothers), Same as tough against AP 3 hits but are being somewhat countered by rending.
It would help giving some better idea of what your opponent brings. Perhaps you could give us his and your lists?
Alien hives do have issues. Especially against harder armoured opponents. Primebrother with medical training in the squad: 54 points. Auto-Rifles (24”, A3), CCWs (A2) 3+2+ Grunt; 13 points. Bio-Guns (12”, A1), Razor Claws (A2). 5+5+
Now the grunts have been upgraded with 2 attacks which is nice and the unit´s usage differs of course but.
5 grunts per Prime brother:
1. Shooting: Prime brother takes one grunt out per turn in shooting. Assuming all morale tests passed for the grunts. If we count the morale then most likely the grunts will be pinned some turns. It takes 42 shots from the grunt to kill the prime. 2. Assault. Prime charging: kills one. The grunts will have about 20% chance of taking the prime down. Most likely the grunts looses the fight 5 against 1. 5 Grunts charging: About 23% chance to take the prime down. Most likely Prime win.
All calculations are based on "fake percentages" (easier to calculate).
It is hard for the Alien hives as armour is very cheap. Survivability is usually much better than the skill to kill or to mass. The Main idea is to outactivate the Primes.
But even Soul snatchers who comes in at 48points with the razor claws upgrade have a lot of issues. If they charge first then 5 should kill about 1-2 with rending. And then 1 more with normal attacks. In return they loose two. So even when the soulsnatchers are at the very best of what they do the Prime brothers are much better. And then we add that prime brothers can shoot e t c.
So armour is a little low prices. it is worth a lot.
Post by gobbothegreen on Jun 15, 2021 14:31:49 GMT
I believe after the rework Alien Hives are a fantastic faction with lots of hard hitting melee and great shooting with a few units. But facing of against prime brothers you would need to be selective on which units to run and hive swarms and grunts will never ever kill anything and are only worth it as cheap objective holders. On the other hand assualt grunts are fantastic if just given poison+furious and most characters and larger aliens can do well with both shooting and melee whichever you choose to specialise in. But alien hives can be tricky to army build as they have a million choices altough now most of them are good, altough you probably got lured into one of the worst possible units in shooty swarms, but see it as a good learning opportunity there is a lot of space to build around and lots of different builds for aliens. They might be glass cannons but they are one hell of a cannon.
While of course plague bros are also fun you shouldnt need to think aliens are necessarily underpowered and not play them as aliens have almost been brought up to battle brother level just requiring less play mistakes becuase of their more glasscannony units.